A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Before you shit on electrics, I'm still willing to allow em, at least when it's electric mopeds/nopeds. Like escooters can go hang with scooters and ebikes can chill with motorized bicycle children - but it's pretty worthwhile to consider the electric conversions like shanghai and personal custom builds like that dude in Jacksonville, and the market-ready electric mopeds like zero and onyx. We're in the same ring

Anyway, there's another one on IndieGOGO, looks pretty slick, Rottwellmeyer Otto -

style theyre clearly aiming at a pre-assembled version of the Shanghai customs cub conversion, the intentional downtube is a nice improvement but the rigid rear is a repeated kick in the butt.

Still at a trager of under 3500 that's pretty legit, looks pretty good, and nice set of specs, 3kW motor should be just shy of 40 and around a 40 mi range. rad!

https://igg.me/at/the-otto/x/19561001#/

https://electrek.co/2019/09/10/rottwellmeyer-electric-moped-1960s-style/

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Make one that has the capability of being hopped up to 55 with a 50 mile range and make it cost less than 2g's. That's the sauce.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

> Charlie BUZZARD Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Make one that has the capability of being hopped up to 55 with a 50 mile

> range and make it cost less than 2g's. That's the sauce.

might require a portable non renewable highly energy dense liquid fuel instead of the battery

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Overpriced Parts /

> Charlie BUZZARD Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Make one that has the capability of being hopped up to 55 with a 50 mile

> range and make it cost less than 2g's. That's the sauce.

Love that 55mph number, it’s just a high enough speed to keep the cagers at bay, even on 35mph roads traffic goes 50+mph many times,

55mph 90-100 mi range, fast charging with quick and easy battery pack changing at stations available and under 2k$ is what would get my interest,

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Must be a scooter - no pedals...

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

ugh

this is really just asking to get banished to OT. its not even a moped for starters, cmon.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Maitland Of the Loin /

You can get under 2K easy if you BYOB

Bring

Your

Own

Battery

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

> Graham Motzing Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> ugh

>

> this is really just asking to get banished to OT. its not even a moped

> for starters, cmon.

2 reasons I'm for keeping it in GenFor

1) the electric discussion in general - already from this discussion we can recognize that because of the ease and extremely low cost of speed upgrades in traditional 2 stroke mopeds, people here are expressing the unrealistic demands we would require to make a switch to electric. Very valid, I think a big appeal to mopeds is the low cost of entry and low cost to improve them piecewise and electrics do not come close

2) it's totally a noped. Like there are motorized bicycles which have small engines and pedals and are definitely NOT mopeds

there are scooters which are small 2 wheel bikes, in most states road legal as "mopeds" and subject to the same rules and regulations, and they are definitely NOT mopeds

and there are bikes in between which target that specific in between, pedals preferred but not being the defining characteristic, that we include in the blanket because they occupy the same space, same parts, same audience

.

likewise you got some electric bicycles, electric scooters, and then these sorta in-betweens that occupy the exact same space and target audiences as a new tomos or whatever. And I totally think it's worth sharing, observing, discussing as on-topic considering mopeds in general!

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

my only gripe with electric vehicles is that for the most part the batteries are disposable. you'll get how ever many cycles of use with diminishing returns on every charge til it doesn't work anymore. then they end up in a landfill and add to the human-earth distruction.

they will never last nearly as long as our gas mopeds. granted most things nowadays are disposable anyway. if i had money to throw away i might buy one. nah, actually i would end up buying more 2smoke bikes.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Maitland Of the Loin /

A battery generally lasts 500-800 cycles, which is roughly 3-4 years

Some of these engine builds don't last that long

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

1) yeah we need to recycle batteries. it's completely idiotic that we don't and really damn simple to get the systems in place to recover the old used ones on bigger items like this. But the problem is the chemistry suuuucks. It takes a lotta energy, and it's messy. basically it's still cheaper not to recycle it

but we also do recycle alotta large scale large size batteries, all teslas go back to source for recycle (unless they burn)

2) the cycles to fail is improving and not all that bad, depending on depth of discharge and charging rates, both of which are easily monitored and controlled with simple electronics, you can pull off 10k cycles with still >50% of the initial power, that could easily be tens of thousands of miles, we're not doing that on these gassy boys. And swapping a battery pack is way easier than rebuilding a motor. Ease of lifetime maintenance is not a winner for ICE

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

I get that 55mph with a 50 mile range and a price tag of sub $2k is maybe unrealistic. But I don't know any better. I'm ignorant to a lot of 2t moped tech still, I damn sure don't know what to expect from an electric moped or moto.

But the fact is, that's what it would take for it to be worth it for me. Maybe I would compromise with the top speed or range some, for the sake of progress. But, we can't all be $5000/30mph early adopters. If 2t moped costed a grip when I started and they weren't capable of exceeding stock speeds, you would have never met me.

Unfair expectations of tech don't always equate unfair expectations of that product's capabilities in relation to it's value. Sure, people used to pay $1500 for CD players. But the cost fell eventually because after the honeymoon phase was over, they weren't worth it. The real value ended up meeting the technology half way because of realistic honest expectations.

Electric vehicles are special, because we have to switch or risk irreversible damage to our planet. So I'm more willing to be on board than not.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

oh come on will, its a C70 which we all know is an underbone motorcycle and not a moped or noped. plus i'm just butthurt because they took off legshields which are the best part of a C70.

you know me, i don't give a shit unless someone reports it.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

I sometimes don't give a shit after things are reported. It's discretion.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

> Graham Motzing Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> oh come on will, its a C70 which we all know is an underbone motorcycle

> and not a moped or noped. plus i'm just butthurt because they took off

> legshields which are the best part of a C70.

>

> you know me, i don't give a shit unless someone reports it.

It could also be a c50 which is a moped.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

I do have a pretty strong bias toward including underbone motorcycles too, that was kinda where I really got into this whole thing.

When I first got my cub any time someone called it a scooter or moped I'd be quick to remind then (tongue in cheek) that it was a "motorcycle"

I'm just curious watching this growing field, which ones are gonna really take root. Zero despite a lotta push seems to have floundered while onyx is blowing up all over. Still blogwise it seems the shanghai cub conversion's gotten the most broad attention. but moto blogs been loving al things cub for a while now...

But like, who's gonna be the winner? Is it one of these that really blows up, or one that's not out yet? or will it be one of the big names throwing a hat in the ring (electric cub, rieju/bye nuuk, Harley's whacky lil e-concepts?) - it's changing fast!

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

We saw an Onyx bike in ATL this weekend parked outside a bar. Not on the ride though. Would have been pretty interesting to see it rip with the rally!

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Maitland Of the Loin /

Govecs Flexy

That's the new hotness, but who knows if it comes to the USA

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Make a separate forum for these electric NOPEDs...…………...then they could have their electric snails right alongside in it.

If people are dumb enough to buy these things, they'll need as forum to commiserate with each other.LOL!

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

We should just make don his own forum.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

theres this too by company named Cake. its got a dirtped feel dont know the specs or the price but it seems dope.

20190912_132725.jpg

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

There are some electric bikes that really would qualify as a moped, not a standard bicycle with motor and not a scooter, but a purpose designed machine, I can't remember the name, but I know where one is, will get pics this weekend if it is still outside, company may be out of business already, advertised on CL for a week or so, this was purchased and from what I can tell never or rarely ridden, shares a parking space with owners car, has fully functional pedals, lights and turn signals, no idea the top speed, has a place for a license plate, but in 2 seasons now has never had one, but if 20mph top speed would not need one in MN. May just leave a note on it this weekend, if it sat outside last winter, (kind of looks like it) the batt pack is prob toast, so it could be cheap/free! :) Electric is the future, if that could go 30 and have a 20 mile range I would rock it, have a limiter switch so it could be governed to 20 for legal reasons, no plate or ins needed. Watch this space...lol.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Looks too easy to bend or break the seat. Not heavy duty.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Stephen ,you keep saying, ` Electric is the future,' …………..but there are many that doubt this.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Stephen ,you keep saying, ` Electric is the future,' …………..but there are

> many that doubt this.

Mainly dumb and ignorant people.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Stephen ,you keep saying, ` Electric is the future,' …………..but there are

> many that doubt this.

For the "moped" segment of transportation there is no doubt about it, when our peds were built an electric version was really outclassed, heavy lead-acid batteries, woefully inefficient controllers, thick wires etc, today this has changed dramatically, yes there is still work to be done, mainly on price, but it will and is happening, at a rate that is hard to imagine. People today have no interest in IC engines, (outside of enthusiasts) they just want it to work, and for those without a garage, an electric bike is safe to bring inside. It will take a long time for electric cars to fully mainstream, especially in harsh climates, but a "moped" class vehicle is the IDEAL platform for electric power. I don't know if mopeds will ever be produced in the numbers they once were, but those that will be built will be electric. I love the gas powered ones, have mine reliable to the point of not needing much tinkering, but it sure would be nice to not have to store fuel, or really maintain anything at all. I'm not a "greenie" just interested in ease of ownership of this class of vehicle, and electric whips 40 yo gas powered antiques.(edited)

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

I just want to see the batteries come down a bit in price

But these are the perfect continuation of mopeds, small, simple, easy to modify

They can also be retrofit which is cool! Will and I have been asking questions on a thread posted on "lovers of tomo" of all places, some guy converted a Targa, he did an excellent job, fitting everything into the existing frame. Off the top of my head he was doing 40mph with a 50mi range? It was all DIY but he said he had about 2g into it.

Does 2 G sound like a lot of money? Ya it is, but you should see some of the price tags for my Mobys....And while faster, I guarantee they arent as reliable as his bike.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

^ Totally worth 2g if those specs are right.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Make your own battery... that’s how to make it cheaper.

Re: A Challenger Approaches - another e-ped enters the ring

Overpriced Parts /

> Daniel '' Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Make your own battery... that’s how to make it cheaper.

Car battery, starter motor and minibike frame, nothing but wheelies for days,

My friend, cousin and I built and ran one in my family’s house large basement when I was 10 years old in the winter from plans on mechanics or popular science mag,

Starter motor held up fine, drivetrain was fine and battery held up fine but the wiring and throttle switch was the weak link because of so many amps,

After burns on all our hands from wiring and the basement full of electrical smelling smoke my parents put it a end to that!

We put the 3 1/2 Tecumseh engine back on it in spring!

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