Variator sliders vs rollers

Terbo Speghetti /

Anybody a die-hard fan of one or the other?

I like the idea of a slider a lot, but they don't come cheap, or in big tuning sets like the rollers do, so I've never been confident enough to order them. I'm sure your ramp plate has a lot to do with it, but beyond that I'm clueless.

Teach me, I'm bored

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

There was a lot of discussion about this years ago with Vespas I think? Where that conversation happened? I couldn’t tell you....

But I feel like Dylan Chubs or maybe Derek from KFC has the answers you seek, or I could be ass backwards wrong, who knows

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Terbo Speghetti /

Yeah I definitely didn't do any searching for previous threads. That sounds even more boring than doing nothing at all lol.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

Not a big fan of Sliders, never really saw that much of a difference compared to maintained and lubed rollers.

This is specifically on Vespa, Derbi, and Hobbit.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Terbo Speghetti /

You lube your rollers? With what?

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Emil Kniemel /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> You lube your rollers? With what?

I have a tube of this but stopped using cause people said not to.

http://www.treatland.tv/malossi-MRG-performance-variator-grease-p/malossi-variatr-grease-7611882.htm

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> You lube your rollers? With what?

I've used graphite dust, or even a very light rubbing of standard synthetic grease. The best option is PTFE, which is hyper light grease.

But really, I lube it with whatever I have on hand, using best judgement.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Terbo Speghetti /

> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > You lube your rollers? With what?

>

> I've used graphite dust, or even a very light rubbing of standard

> synthetic grease. The best option is PTFE, which is hyper light grease.

>

> But really, I lube it with whatever I have on hand, using best

> judgement.

Well I know I'm not taking your advice. Try air if you don't like whipping oil and grease all over. That's what every other sane owner of a variated bike does.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > > Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

>

> >

>

> > > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> > > You lube your rollers? With what?

>

> >

>

> > I've used graphite dust, or even a very light rubbing of standard

>

> > synthetic grease. The best option is PTFE, which is hyper light

> grease.

>

> >

>

> > But really, I lube it with whatever I have on hand, using best

>

> > judgement.

>

> Well I know I'm not taking your advice. Try air if you don't like

> whipping oil and grease all over. That's what every other sane owner of

> a variated bike does.

Never had grease whip out of a variator, owned and built more than enough variated bikes.

You don't think manufacturers put together stock bikes with lubricant on the rollers?

Or maybe Malossi, Polini, etc, etc, all just sell Variator weight lube as a gimmick?

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) /

> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > > Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:

>

> >

>

> > > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> > > > Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

>

> >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> > > > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> > > > You lube your rollers? With what?

>

> >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> > > I've used graphite dust, or even a very light rubbing of standard

>

> >

>

> > > synthetic grease. The best option is PTFE, which is hyper light

>

> > grease.

>

> >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> > > But really, I lube it with whatever I have on hand, using best

>

> >

>

> > > judgement.

>

> >

>

> > Well I know I'm not taking your advice. Try air if you don't like

>

> > whipping oil and grease all over. That's what every other sane owner

> of

>

> > a variated bike does.

>

> Never had grease whip out of a variator, owned and built more than

> enough variated bikes.

>

> You don't think manufacturers put together stock bikes with lubricant on

> the rollers?

>

> Or maybe Malossi, Polini, etc, etc, all just sell Variator weight lube

> as a gimmick?

YEAH DILLON, didn't you know that the stock O-ring/grease retainer you find on every derbi variator is just for show? They spent a ton of money on R&D for it just so you could make yourself look a fool on the internet some 40 years later.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

> Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> YEAH DILLON, didn't you know that the stock O-ring/grease retainer you

> find on every derbi variator is just for show? They spent a ton of money

> on R&D for it just so you could make yourself look a fool on the

> internet some 40 years later.

They got me again.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Terbo Speghetti /

> Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

> YEAH DILLON, didn't you know that the stock O-ring/grease retainer you

> find on every derbi variator is just for show? They spent a ton of money

> on R&D for it just so you could make yourself look a fool on the

> internet some 40 years later.

LOL how much money did it take to say "hey that thing spins fast and throws the grease in it at us, let's put a seal in there."

Just the thought that anyone spent "tons of money" developing even an entire moped is fuckin stupid, much less the seal on the vario.

And once again, look at any modern variator and show me where to put a seal to keep grease inside.

You won't find it.

But cool, keep believing that no one could have learned anything since 1982, that's fine by me.(edited)

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Do they make ceramic or ceramic coated rollers / sliders .

No lube would be recommended .

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

>

> > YEAH DILLON, didn't you know that the stock O-ring/grease retainer you

>

> > find on every derbi variator is just for show? They spent a ton of

> money

>

> > on R&D for it just so you could make yourself look a fool on the

>

> > internet some 40 years later.

>

> LOL how much money did it take to say "hey that thing spins fast and

> throws the grease in it at us, let's put a seal in there."

>

> Just the thought that anyone spent "tons of money" developing even an

> entire moped is fuckin stupid, much less the seal on the vario.

>

> And once again, look at any modern variator and show me where to put a

> seal to keep grease inside.

>

> You won't find it.

>

> But cool, keep believing that no one could have learned anything since

> 1982, that's fine by me.

You're kidding, right?

https://www.treatland.tv/vespa-polini-BLUE-plastic-variator-grease-guard-p/polini-blue-guard-909.156.htm

or

https://www.treatland.tv/OEM-honda-NU50-urban-express-NX50-express-cover-p/oem-ramp-22126-ga7-700.htm(edited)

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

I'm always worried sliders will over-variate and put stress on the crank.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

Totally don't lube your variators, they definitely don't include lube with new variators for modern scooters.

Capture1.PNG

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

>

> > YEAH DILLON, didn't you know that the stock O-ring/grease retainer you

>

> > find on every derbi variator is just for show? They spent a ton of

> money

>

> > on R&D for it just so you could make yourself look a fool on the

>

> > internet some 40 years later.

>

> LOL how much money did it take to say "hey that thing spins fast and

> throws the grease in it at us, let's put a seal in there."

>

> Just the thought that anyone spent "tons of money" developing even an

> entire moped is fuckin stupid, much less the seal on the vario

Do you have any idea how much it costs to develop tooling? For example, to stamp sheet metal in multiple stages and make/alter molds to cast appropriate features in the variator to accept the part? ESPECIALLY back in the early 70's when computer aided design (CAD) was still very new and only just starting to be used for making cars, let alone mopeds? I'd wager at least tens of thousands of dollars went just into that silly grease cover...but a dollar's a penny to you apparently!

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

I like sliders better. I don’t lube sliders but I lube rollers......

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

DrGeorgeTompson (Alan) /

I use that MRG grease still. A nice light coat. It dries and turns into a graphite powder. I think my derbi is dry. Idk, i like to lube cause i tend to find a lot of flat spots on the rollers if i don't.

I've also used like teflon spray. I think it's just nice to have it all slippy up in that bitch. Does it make a difference? i dunno. I have a really hard time just making one change at a time so it's difficult to trace.

I have sliders in my vespa. I only ever bought one set and kinda guessed what the proper weight would be based on what rollers i was running at the time. Idk, i like them but that's probably because i paid for them. The price tag doesn't really seem worth it in hindsight.

I lube the sliders just the same.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

you can get generic sliders for 8-12 dollars shipped on ebay.

they let the belt ride a bit lower for better low end, but it depends on the shape of the ramp plate.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Terbo Speghetti /

> Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > > Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

>

> >

>

> > > YEAH DILLON, didn't you know that the stock O-ring/grease retainer

> you

>

> >

>

> > > find on every derbi variator is just for show? They spent a ton of

>

> > money

>

> >

>

> > > on R&D for it just so you could make yourself look a fool on the

>

> >

>

> > > internet some 40 years later.

>

> >

>

> > LOL how much money did it take to say "hey that thing spins fast and

>

> > throws the grease in it at us, let's put a seal in there."

>

> >

>

> > Just the thought that anyone spent "tons of money" developing even an

>

> > entire moped is fuckin stupid, much less the seal on the vario

>

> Do you have any idea how much it costs to develop tooling? For example,

> to stamp sheet metal in multiple stages and make/alter molds to cast

> appropriate features in the variator to accept the part? ESPECIALLY back

> in the early 70's when computer aided design (CAD) was still very new

> and only just starting to be used for making cars, let alone mopeds? I'd

> wager at least tens of thousands of dollars went just into that silly

> grease cover...but a dollar's a penny to you apparently!

If you think they custom made every part on your moped you're even dumber than I thought.

ESPECIALLY before they had CAD to make the design process that much simpler.

They used whatever they have, especially for an economy shittercycle.

As for the pictures, yes the lube is a gimmick.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> As for the pictures, yes the lube is a gimmick.

Sure man, it's just a conspiracy across the whole belt-driven cycle world and only you are brave enough to expose the truth about the evil Italian aftermarket corporations.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) /

> Terbo Speghetti Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Brandon Weiss (Detective brandon to you) Wrote:

>

>

> If you think they custom made every part on your moped you're even

> dumber than I thought.

>

> ESPECIALLY before they had CAD to make the design process that much

> simpler.

>

> They used whatever they have, especially for an economy shittercycle.

>

Every part? For the first derbi variant which is the example I used, I bet they did! There was nothing like it before it, you can't just pull parts from thin air. The variator grease gaurd happens to be a unique part, so it WAS indeed developed for that moped, along with probably 99% of the rest of it. They even did it MULTIPLE times for different models. For example, the clutch bells from flatreed and pp/pr are unique and non interchangeable, as is 99% of the rest of the engine.

The fact that this concept is so foreign to you is really mindblowing.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

So who likes pineapple on their pizza?

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

> Toledo Riot Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> So who likes pineapple on their pizza?

Only with lube to get them down my throat.

Re: Variator sliders vs rollers

Dirty30 Dillon /

> EH FCC of the QCB Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Toledo Riot Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > So who likes pineapple on their pizza?

>

> Only with lube to get them down my throat.

Get in my gullet

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