Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Also, for people who are interested in learning/understanding more about this, do some research into 'trickle down economics' theory and politics dating back to the reconstruction/gilded age. Shit will blow yer mind.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Graham Motzing Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> yeah the older i've gotten and the more i understand the political

> history of the US, my viewpoint on the two party system has changed a

> lot... not so much my hatred of it, but more understanding how the

> predominant power brokers have leveraged different ideologies to

> manipulate people into these two perfectly balanced damn near 50/50

> parties.

>

> As it pertains to Ross Perot, as a third party candidate, what i'm

> saying is that abortion and the host of other issues i mentioned have no

> basis in conservative political ideology, as some people leave the party

> over one issue (say conservative republicans leaving due to a new york

> tax-and-spend liberal democrat- Trump- conning his way into a republican

> nomination) - other people (such as democrat white nationalists) get

> brought into the fold and become republicans, but the 50/50 is

> maintained by adding or shifting on these hot button issues.

>

> The rich and powerful minority are always leveraging the votes of a

> poorer majority by manipulating the party messaging. What is

> interesting - in a very Orwellian sense- is how at different times in

> history this messaging has shifted... some really good ones to pay

> attention to is Abraham Lincoln, McKinley/Roosevelt, and

> Kennedy/Johnson. In all these cases the traditional power brokers got

> bucked either due to overwhelming popularism and/or an assassination...

> essentially the guys trying to hold the reigns on democracy got bucked

> off for a minute. If you watch the way the parties and the messaging

> changed during these periods to maintain the 50/50 balance, it teaches

> you a lot about how our government works.

>

> I think the Trump thing is going to go down as another one of these

> major seismic shifts, its interesting to be experiencing it in real

> time. Watching the conventional powers trying to maintain their 50/50

> balance and control political institutions while popularists on the left

> push for a Sanders nomination, and popularists on the far right

> consolidate around a nationalist message.

>

> What is interesting about the bicameral system in America is that it

> doesn't align to the conventional socialist vs. nationalist platforms

> that most other countries have naturally settled on. The Trump thing

> is- in my opinion- a transition back to a more organic political

> narrative dividing people into 'Nationalists/ Fascists' and

> 'Socialist/communists.' The wealthy and powerful, trying to maintain

> the power structure, will obviously message this to continue to maintain

> 50/50 voting balance to keep politics stable. You cant go out and say

> 'we are the party for the top 5%' and 'we are the party for the bottom

> 95%' without it being a pretty conclusive landslide of voting, so you

> have to split up these hot-button albeit entirely inconsequential issues

> to keep the voting split even and maintain upper crust protectionisim

> within both parties.

>

> does that all make sense?

No. You're WAY over-thinking it...………...the people just got tired of the giveaway of the country's wealth to illegal immigrants. THAT's why Trump was elected.

Simple! The wall!

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Blaine- The artist formerly known as Plumber Crack "(OFMC)" /

You’re wrong again don. Trump only got elected because nobody can stand hillary.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Blaine- The artist formerly known as Plumber Crack "(OFMC)" Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> You’re wrong again don. Trump only got elected because nobody can stand

> hillary.

LOL! Good one,Blaine!

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Jimmy Cincinnati Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

But i do not kill children for crimes

> of their fathers nor would i kill children because they would be born

> into poverty.

I think we've boiled it down to the crux of it, your definition of a child is the religiously decreed life begins at conception vs viability. It's not killing a child, it's not having a child. and that should be the choice of the people who would have to care for it, based on whether they could care for it. but this is a point we'll never agree on. which is precisely why it's such a powerful rally cry for politicians on either side.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Born to be WillD Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Jimmy Cincinnati Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> But i do not kill children for crimes

>

> > of their fathers nor would i kill children because they would be born

>

> > into poverty.

>

> I think we've boiled it down to the crux of it, your definition of a

> child is the religiously decreed life begins at conception vs viability.

> It's not killing a child, it's not having a child. and that should be

> the choice of the people who would have to care for it, based on whether

> they could care for it. but this is a point we'll never agree on. which

> is precisely why it's such a powerful rally cry for politicians on

> either side.

Man's so-called wisdom about WHEN it's a life in the womb will not matter when called to account for killing the most innocent of mankind.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Born to be WillD Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > > Jimmy Cincinnati Wrote:

>

> >

>

> > > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> > But i do not kill children for crimes

>

> >

>

> > > of their fathers nor would i kill children because they would be

> born

>

> >

>

> > > into poverty.

>

> >

>

> > I think we've boiled it down to the crux of it, your definition of a

>

> > child is the religiously decreed life begins at conception vs

> viability.

>

> > It's not killing a child, it's not having a child. and that should be

>

> > the choice of the people who would have to care for it, based on

> whether

>

> > they could care for it. but this is a point we'll never agree on.

> which

>

> > is precisely why it's such a powerful rally cry for politicians on

>

> > either side.

>

> Man's so-called wisdom about WHEN it's a life in the womb will not

> matter when called to account for killing the most innocent of mankind.

All religion aside,

We are all using the same "wisdom" to kill future children every day by burning fossil fuels and polluting the atmosphere.

At some point the environment will become so bad that anyone born into it will die. Maybe not in our lifetimes but we all still contributed to it.

Fossil fuels aside, everything mankind is doing is diminishing the future lives of all children.

We are cockroaches that have over run the planet. We take and put nothing back. We dont care about living in harmony with the earth much less with each other. We belong to the earth, the earth does not belong to us. Without the earth we cannot survive. A big enough natural disaster will restore balance again. Migrating to another planet or moon will only start the whole proccess over.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Jimmy Cincinnati /

I think we've boiled it down to the crux of it, your definition of a child is the religiously decreed life begins at conception vs viability.

The only constant point you can reference for when life begins is conception. Viability does not dictate life. Once the egg is fertilized, when left in normal conditions it will grow into a person like you & I. There is no magical principal that suddenly declares person hood when the child travels 6 inches out the vaginal canal.

People on life support are not viable, should we be able to kill them?

It's not killing a child, it's not having a child.

The only way to "not have the child" is to kill it. Stop sugar coating it.

Whats funny is when someone has a planned pregnancy they are pregnant with a baby. When its unplanned some how its considered less than human... a bundle of cells.

and that should be the choice of the people who would have to care for it, based on whether they could care for it.

Murder should never be any ones choice... its evil. We dont kill someone because life will be tough.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Jimmy Cincinnati Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Murder should never be any ones choice... its evil. We dont kill someone

> because life will be tough.

Its no differnt than murdering future life to make our own easier.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Every thread? Fuck man.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Blaine- The artist formerly known as Plumber Crack "(OFMC)" /

> jayson sumpter Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Every thread? Fuck man.

Yep. Fucking Don, AGAIN.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Andrew Squiggman /

If abortion was legal a year before Don was born, we possibly might not have had to listen to his garbage ad nauseum.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

I'm speaking out for the defenseless ones. There are a LOT of us that have Bible-trained consciences and we will NOT surrender our souls to the Devil.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

What kills me about the Catholics, (yes I was raised guilty too) is that they are also against contraception as well, which if used would all but eliminate the need for abortions....wtf?

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it."

-Upton Sinclair

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Can anyone explain the disdain for contraception when you believe abortion is wrong? If you prevent conception, no need to abort...seems pretty straightforward...

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I'm speaking out for the defenseless ones. There are a LOT of us that

> have Bible-trained consciences and we will NOT surrender our souls to

> the Devil.

Spirituality is important, not religion or the Bible.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

We should use contraception. Catholics can't support their anti-contraceptive stance scripturally, I don't think.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Andrew Squiggman /

It’s amazing. Simply amazing. Inside Donald’s pea brain, he is the only all knowing one. Everyone else in the world is wrong. He is infallible. He never was misled. he is right and everyone else is wrong. You can’t teach someone anything if they are totally convinced all the time they are right. Couldn’t possibly look at another point of view.

What a tiny rubber walled life to live in.

This goes for the Donald from Ohio as well.(edited)

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

I remember being taught that even contraception was wrong...you should not be doing it at all unless to procreate, not to recreate, we all know that is silly, never going to happen, but you should think a bit, wrap it up, have her be on the pill or other or both, it should be talked out before you get all worked up...engage in acts that will not cause pregnancy...not rocket science. It is this nonsense that drove me from the church proper, but not from it's teachings of how to act, I fail often, but I will not bother with the talking in circles and denouncing perfectly natural urges, ones that if you are a die hard believer your god created you with...organized religion is bullshit, a power grab from a time when only the elite could read and be educated. We were created in his image...ok, we are imperfect, so he/it must be as well, right? Whatever. Bad Catholic joke: How do you get a nun pregnant? Dress her as an alter boy.... I can say that joke as I was raised catholic, it is a minority of the clergy that are abusers, but they are there and for real, victims brainwashed by belief that a priest can do no wrong afraid to talk...yeah, that's gods will, were there a god he/she/it would be enraged by how humans have perverted the instruction of how to live harmoniously into a power structure. Do the best you can, if you fail, and you will, do your best to make up for it, come the end if there is a judgement you will be fine, but chances are, we are all just worm food, closed ecosystem.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

"The meek shall claim the earth" that is not poor humans, but the bacteria that shall break down the mighty, us as we die. We think we are all there is, we are destroying this world with greed and ignorance. The world was created as a whole, not just for us, but for every living thing, we have outgrown our space and will be purged, not entirely, but back to manageable levels. The Earth is not in trouble, WE are.

Fav biblical sounding quote that is not from the bible...

" Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out" Sipowitz "10:42"

From a late night episode of NYPD Blue last night as he shooed a bible thumper out of an interview room who was quoting bible verses at him. 10:42 was the time on his watch...

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Andrew Squiggman /

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I'm speaking out of my butt. for the defenseless ones. There are a LOT of us that

> have Bible-trained consciences and we will NOT surrender our souls to

> the Devil.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

The beauty of spirituality is that it gives everyone globally the chance to respect each others inner beliefs without judging or taking sides on some bullshit political regional religion.

What would our creator really want?

Those of you that have multiple kids are the creator of your own childern. How would you feel to watch them bicker or wage war on each other over opposing beliefs or opinions? And what would you tell them?

Religion=control(edited)

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> live ɘvil Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> The beauty of spirituality is that it gives everyone globally the chance

> to respect each others inner beliefs without judging or taking sides on

> some bullshit political regional religion.

>

> What would our creator really want?

>

> Those of you that have multiple kids are the creator of your own

> childern. How would you feel to watch them bicker or wage war on each

> other over opposing beliefs or opinions? And what would you tell them?

>

> Religion=control

The problem is not the Bible. It TELLS US what God wants. He does not want bad deeds.

The bad deeds are the problem. Rejecting His moral standards are the problem. Which religion rejects them? More and more, almost all religions reject God's standards.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Nicely written, Graham and Will.

As always I am not surprised by the amount of white male privilege coming from the duddles of Ohio. Not your body, not your life, shut your damn mouth about it. What's more is that making a service people need illegal just creates a black market that is far more dangerous. Your bullshit religious values infringe on a woman's personal freedom, I think Jimbo and Donny could benefit from a little bit of empathy.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Blaine- The artist formerly known as Plumber Crack "(OFMC)" /

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I'm speaking out to spread fear and ignorance. There are a LOT of us that

> have Bible-brainwashed consciences and we will NOT surrender our souls to

> facts, common sense, or reality.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Appreciation for a, Good looking Turd !.

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

Overpriced Parts /

> Blaine- The artist formerly known as Plumber Crack "(OFMC)" Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Trump only got elected because nobody can stand

> hillary.

Yep pretty much how it went Blane and the people wanted to try somebody new that wasn't a lifelong politician,

I didn’t vote, I was laid up at the time but my union said to vote for Hillary and most every Democrat in local races except for one or two because supposedly they vote for the best candidate that suits our needs, if you could believe that, but there are some Republicans are on the list that are labor friendly,

don’t know how I would’ve voted, but the last Democrat we had for Ohio Governor (Strickland) almost ran us out of money, Republican governor John kasich (Who hates trump and has tds still today) was voted in and we ended up having a balanced budget and surplus that’s why this time another Republican publican governor was voted in again,

All this politics sucks because all people do is talk and infight even their own party instead of passing good legislation, we’ll see how everything plays out in 2020.

I really don’t really care who or what side a politician is on, they just need to stop fighting each other and pass some good legislation that will benefit the people who pay their wages,

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

> Don Ohio Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > live ɘvil Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > The beauty of spirituality is that it gives everyone globally the

> chance

>

> > to respect each others inner beliefs without judging or taking sides

> on

>

> > some bullshit political regional religion.

>

> >

>

> > What would our creator really want?

>

> >

>

> > Those of you that have multiple kids are the creator of your own

>

> > childern. How would you feel to watch them bicker or wage war on each

>

> > other over opposing beliefs or opinions? And what would you tell them?

>

> >

>

> > Religion=control

>

> The problem is not the Bible. It TELLS US what God wants. He does not

> want bad deeds.

>

> The bad deeds are the problem. Rejecting His moral standards are the

> he problem. Which religion rejects them? More and more, almost all

> religions reject God's standards.

Read my post again closely Don. ^^^

I never mentioned the Bible.

I never mentioned a particular religion.

But since you brought it up.

The bible at best is a debatable story book. I dont believe in the Bible (or Santa clause) so please don't waste your time or mine refferencing it.

The creator can show and tell me what it wants if it chooses. I dont need a man-made story book, religion or belief telling me what's right or wrong. No thanks, its all everyday common sense.

Don Christianity is nothing more than one side of the story. If thats what you want great!(edited)

Re: Ross Perot dead at 89

The deeds tell the story is all I'm saying. When a church approves things God condemns, it cannot be a way to the truth.

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