Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

With the ongoing issues I have been having I installed the clutch drum off the parts bikes and glory be, it works! I am thinking I should have used the entire clutch as now it is rubbing like there is a low spot in the drum.

I am thinking that the drum wasn't seating on the taper, it is a few thousands deeper than the drum off the parts bike and maybe it (the original drum) hits the snap ring before seating on the taper. I will take the original drum to a friend who has both a mill and a lathe and make it right.

Cheers

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Most excellent news, John.

Keep letting everyone know how the restore of the bike is going, cool indeed.

Now we just have to convince you to restore the 'parts bike'

OR

if it is in need of lots maybe you can build a killer moped out of it for extra + speed.

Disclaimer:

BoughtfrenchMoped.jpg

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

I understand the feeling illustrated by your picture. My moped buddy is urging me to get the parts bike running once I finish the 63. Need to flush the tanks on both bikes get new plugs and figure out what is rubbing in the clutch.

I thought dealing with old British Bikes was a hassle!

Thank you all for your help and insight.

John in Texas

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Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Nice herd you have there, John

Indeed Brit bikes can be a pain, just our simple Bantam D1 Plunger kept me busy as well as our old 650 Lightning back in the day. Certainly would be excellent to have a longer "comfort season" like in Texas than the short season (if you dont winter ride, which we do, but it is getting more challenging as we get older) like we do here in CanadaLand.

Frenchy mopeds are fun, lots of good stock power hidden in them if you are a guy who likes to tinker, lots of aftermarket stuff if that is how you want to roll. Larger Frenchies are a lot more challenging due to lack of parts - even in France.

ANYHOW - good to meet another person who is nutz on old two wheel vehicles, look forward to see both your little frenchies on the road.

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

I have a question, well 2 really.

Which is best the 4 ball variator or the 3 ball one? Also while researching I read that 1 place recommended that if you are using the 4 ball one to only use 2 of the balls as that makes the clutch work faster or better.

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Variators original design has 38 x 6,35mm balls on the AV/AU36 and 37 Mobys with notches in the movable cheek shaft so it clicked through "3 speeds". Then they went to 6 x 11,9mm balls, then lost the notches, then just the 3 or 4 ball flavours.

The balls are flyweights that work against the tension of the counter spring on the lower engine mount. More balls will have the variator go from low speed to high speed faster, less balls and the variator will take longer to get to the top 'gear'.

If you are going to castrate your variator you would need to run 2 balls in a 4 ball cage (or a aftermarket 2 ball cage) so you can maintain balance. You would then want to run with a launch lever so you can over ride the flyweights on demand and make it semi automatic.

Alternatively you can just stuff the counter spring to add more tension against the balls.

> John Ebert Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I have a question, well 2 really.

>

> Which is best the 4 ball variator or the 3 ball one? Also while

> researching I read that 1 place recommended that if you are using the 4

> ball one to only use 2 of the balls as that makes the clutch work faster

> or better.

>

> John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

OK, What counter spring? Been in and out of that clutch 3 times and besides the springs between the shoes there are no springs.

John

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Never mind, I just re-read your post and now understand what was said about the spring at the bottom of the engine.

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

God I wish that our riding season was "comfortable" the weather just broke and it is just now cooling off. If I didn't get out for an early morning ride it was just to hot by 10 to get out. But, now that the weather has started to cool it's time to get with the program and figure out what is going on with the Mobylette.

I ask questions because I know what I don't know, and what I don't know is much about mopeds and my Mobylette in particular.

Headed out to the garage to explore what I don't know.

Cheers

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

> John Ebert Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> God I wish that our riding season was "comfortable" the weather just

> broke and it is just now cooling off. If I didn't get out for an early

> morning ride it was just to hot by 10 to get out. But, now that the

> weather has started to cool it's time to get with the program and figure

> out what is going on with the Mobylette.

>

> Cheers

>

> John in Texas

We're headed for Texas , slowly . I saw something about 90+° and didn't want to get there too soon .

We spent the Summer of '18 in New Mexico on the shore of Caballo Lake . We know all too well about that too hot by 10 stuff . ;)

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

We lived in Phoenix for 50 years, if it weren't for AC no one would live there. I remember a few nights when it didn't drop below 90.

What part of Texas are you going to?

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

We'll just be meandering East Texas for the most part .

First will be Wright Patman Lake , then Tyler , then Moscow and we're not too sure where we'll head from there .

Just depends on the weather . If it stays decent , we'll stay Northish , but we're not opposed to eventually seeing the Padre Islands or the RVG .

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Yep - guess too hot would probably be as annoying as too cold...

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> John Ebert Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> God I wish that our riding season was "comfortable" the weather just

> broke and it is just now cooling off. If I didn't get out for an early

> morning ride it was just to hot by 10 to get out. But, now that the

> weather has started to cool it's time to get with the program and figure

> out what is going on with the Mobylette.

>

> I ask questions because I know what I don't know, and what I don't know

> is much about mopeds and my Mobylette in particular.

>

> Headed out to the garage to explore what I don't know.

>

> Cheers

>

> John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Rebel is right . Cold has it's drawbacks , too .

I recall one year I had no cage for protection from the Michigan winter . I rode until the day after Thanksgiving . Then the ice took toll and I had to beg a ride to work until the 2nd of February when I could ride again . It was cold , but , dry . So , I rode , dressed in an insulated coverall .

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Indeed - anywhere cold enough to be cold cold you would want to get a 'snowmobile' outfit to wear AND add extra protection for your knuckles (MX grip guards) knees and toes (leg shields work well).

ALSO

If the temperature is hovering just above or just below freezing, the moisture in the air will be a catalyst for carb icing, so you could end up with a throttle stuck at WOT.

You may want to add a heat pipe to get some warmth off the exterior of your exhause and pipe it up to the carb to keep the frost at bay.

> P D Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Rebel is right . Cold has it's drawbacks , too .

>

> I recall one year I had no cage for protection from the Michigan winter

> . I rode until the day after Thanksgiving . Then the ice took toll and I

> had to beg a ride to work until the 2nd of February when I could ride

> again . It was cold , but , dry . So , I rode , dressed in an insulated

> coverall .

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

As I was checking things over and checking continuity on the wires from the points to the coil I noticed cracks in the coil, several of them in fact. Checked the parts bikes and it too had a cracked coil. I have one on order and hope to have it by the endof the week. It's always something.

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Still looking for that elusive spark. I have replaced the plug and coil, nothing.

I hooked up a meter to the output side of the magneto to see what if any voltage was coming out, you guessed it nothing. Going to remove the magneto and inspect all the bits and see if I can determine what is not going on.

I did remove the cover around the clutch and with it out of the way the clutch works like it should. The clutch was rubbing the cover causing a drag on the clutch, on issue solved.

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

If the external Novi coil has a crack in it and seems to be chalky finish on it it will likely be problematic.

ALL Mobys suffer from a crappy bonding strap between the motor and frame. Original is mounted at the upper motor mount long bolt and goes to the external ignition coil's lower stud. Replace that wire with one that runs from one of the intake studs and goes to the external ignition coil's lower stud.

Mobys also have troubles with the condenser, heat is a byproduct of electrical generation in the magneto, heat is the sworn enemy of condensers, Novi 120 magnetos do not have ventilation in the flywheel. Disconnect the original condenser from the points (Blue wire or Blue with black tracer) and remove the old condenser. Get a mid 1960s Delco 6 cylinder condenser (or similar vintage BoschVW condenser) and mount it on the external coil's lower mounting stud (either condenser comes with a handy mounting bracket included). Splice the pigtail to the grey wire that goes to the external coil.

Clean the points with a metal file and flush with brake cleaner or alcohol (sand paper leaves grit behind that can cause arcing on the points, carb cleaner has a lube in it which will cause misfiring so dont use those) and set the points gap at index to 0,4mm. Set the spark initiation at 1,5mm BTDC.

Do not use a resistor plug because the antiparasite plug cap already has a built in resistor.

You now should have a goodly bright blue snappy spark that is strong enough to be seen in just the shadow of the bike.

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

OK, now that sounds like the ticket, I will do that later today. I had considered the condenser but hadn't considered moving it. On Brit bikes with Lucas magnetos as they age the condenser fails, they could be brand new and be bad in the box.

Bringing an old bike back to life is always interesting. Thank you for your advise, I will report back later today.

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

I know all too well some of the old Brit wiring nightmares and the very infamous Lucas (Prince of Darkness) electrics. Amazing how a country which has such damp weather could have electronics with reliability at that level.

I have some Raleigh mopeds with the Canadian spec electronics, British WIPAC ignitions are way superior to the Lucas attempts, nicer 'headlamps' and 'taillamps' as well, not dim and small.

Due to the proximity of the condensers in all magnetos, mounting them externally makes sense on a lot of engines, not just Motobecane/Motoconfort ones.

> John Ebert Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> OK, now that sounds like the ticket, I will do that later today. I had

> considered the condenser but hadn't considered moving it. On Brit bikes

> with Lucas magnetos as they age the condenser fails, they could be brand

> new and be bad in the box.

>

> Bringing an old bike back to life is always interesting. Thank you for

> your advise, I will report back later today.

>

> John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

You know you wanna sell me those leg shields!

> Downhill Harvey (OFMC) Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > John Ebert Wrote:

>

> > here are pictures of the

>

> > parts bike that was asked for

>

> Oh man, that parts bike has just about everything I need. My roller,

> with an engine in a box, needs ,

>

> one tank badge, headlight ring, left side cover, headlight switch, and

> brake light switch,

>

> Is that a Motobecane, or a Wards Riverside? Virtually identical, except

> for the tank badge. Mine was also missing the piston, cylinder, intake,

> and carb, and the cylinder head/motor mount spacers, but I have all that

> now. I have the leg shields, but not the mounting hardware. I see yours

> has the left , and head-tube mounts still on the bike.

>

> ......................but I give it all up, for a dent free rear fender.

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

I don't have any leg shields?

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

Was quoting Harvey, he said he has a set

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

When you say to splice the condenser to the gray wire is there a Y? Gray wire to condenser then on to the coil?

Also is there a way to check the output of the ignition and lighting windings?

Thank you all for your help.

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

John

Just strip a little section of the grey with net the terminal where it goes into the external coilandsplice the pigtail there into the grey wire.

Output of the cols will be in AC: ~6v for the ignition exciter, ~6v for the 6v terminal and ~12v for the 12v terminal. On the magnetos with two coils the 6v terminal is actually the tail for the ignition exciter, so if that is not connected to the wire harness it will need to be shorted to common (ground). On magnetor with 3 coils there is a separate coil for the 6v accessory.

Check accessory coil(s) and exciter coil with a ohmmeter the value should be 1-2Ω.

> John Ebert Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> When you say to splice the condenser to the gray wire is there a Y?

> Gray wire to condenser then on to the coil?

>

> Also is there a way to check the output of the ignition and lighting

> windings?

>

> Thank you all for your help.

>

> John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

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Looking at my bike, the with coming off the ignition field or coil is hooked to the points and the gray wire is also attached there and the condenser was attached to the same point. So the only thing I have changed is the location of the condenser.

I removed the ignition field and can't see any obvious damage, I do think that my issues are due to the condenser.

Thank you again for your help and patience.

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

John

Get your puller and get the cam off off the crankshaft so you can time the bike properly one you get the magneto back together.

One like this will service the ignition cam and the other end is for the clutch, if you dont have one yet.

https://www.treatland.tv/24mm-x-1mm-26mm-x-1mm-puller-for-honda-mbk-p/24x1-26x1-honda-mbk-puller.htm

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

More gremlins, so what is new! I have done as was suggested and I was putting it back together and I must had dinged the threads on the magneto side while seating or removing the cam.

Looking at the copy of the parts book that I have, which is in French, the part number for the LH nut is 16729 for the AV88. Using my dial mic on my 63 AV88 it measures 10mm, the parts bike measures 11mm.

I have a thread file on order to clean up the threads on the crank. I would like to get a new nut but those that I have seen are 11mm, where might I find the correct size one?

John in Texas

Re: New to me, 63 Mobyelette AV88

If you have not already, I would suggest to double check with a 10mm open end wrench on the threaded portion as a go/no-go gauge to verify it is a 10mm thread. If the 10mm open end wrench slips on then it is 10mm, if not it is 11mm.

Anyhow the 10mm "Ecrou M10 Novi gauche" nut is available from Marc Deschamps at Lesolex in France

6 sides for 3€ plus shipping and handling (with or without plug)

http://www.lesolex.com/catalogue/4664-ecrou-rotor-motobecane-10-100-gauche.html

10mm (3/8)square drive for 4.5 € plus shipping and handling

http://www.lesolex.com/catalogue/4663-ecrou-rotor-motobecane-10-100-gauche.html

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