Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

I'm trying to find an aftermarket spring option for the Camino Euro driven pulley..

I'd like to make this thread a list of available spring measurements (Wire diameter, spring inner diameter, free height) so we can add it to the wiki and play around with the different aftermarket scooter springs out there.

If you've got some scooter springs out there, please measure and add to the list!

I'll start with PA50s

Honda Hobbit U.S.

stock: (used) 3mm wire diameter, 30mm spring ID, 62mm free height

yellow: 3.1mm wire diameter (painted), 30mm spring ID, 74mm free height

red: 3.1mm wire diameter (painted), 30mm spring ID, 82mm free height

Honda Camino Euro

stock: (used) 3.5mm wire diameter, 40mm spring ID, 82mm free height

help me out! (edited)

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

You need to add in compressed coilbound height, as it's a HUGE factor.

Such limited room in the hobbit pulley at the fully open position.

I was thinking about the camino pulley the other day. Since the spring is mostly external, what about modding the base and cap to accept a standard horizontal minarelli spring? Cuz they come in so many flavors. (edited)

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

I don't really know how to measure that last factor.

Do you know the minarelli spring ID? That's a great idea, I'll see if I can fab something up!

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

i think minarelli is 50mm, I suggested NCY, and now I'm curious - they list alot of the sizes and the springs also have the numbers printed on them if you can find good res pics

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

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take the spring out and sand 1/4 of it down, 1/2 way thru the wire and reinstall. see if you like that. or take it out and sand 1/2 of it down 1/2 way thru the wire and check that. thats where i keep mine with 5-6gram. its kinda like Jbots progressive spring action.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

wire diameter on most is 4-5mm depending on stiffness

GY6 50 and the big ones

Inner diameter: 48.5 mm

Length: 154 mm

The shitty China "GY6-50" but really QMB139

Inner Diameter 49mm

Length: 106mm

Zuma/Jog Minarelli

Inner Diameter:44.0mm

Length: 108.0mm

Zuma 125 4strokes

Inner Diameter: 54.5mm

Length: 116mm

This site has a lot listed

http://www.koso.com.tw/products-detail.php?id=252&lang=en

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

You compress the spring full in a vice and measure it's coilbound length.

In my experience, my yellow contra bound up before full variation, don't know if the red is the same. It was about 2mm to shave off the spring to let the pulley travel all the way

Btw, might sound silly but if you need to make a short sleeve to keep a larger spring centered internally on a driven pulley, the outer race from a standard moped crank bearing works excellently welded to a washer

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

I wish scooter sites would make it a habit to list dimensions.

This slider base looks like it could be a solution for modding the cap to fit a larger diameter spring.

But what size to get?

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

πΏπ‘–π‘˜π‘Ž-πΏπ‘œπ‘‘π‘Žπ‘ π‘Žπ‘’π‘Ÿ π‘€π‘’π‘”π‘Žπ‘π‘’π‘  πŸ¦– /

JBOT: A mean mean man. Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> You need to add in compressed coilbound height, as

> it's a HUGE factor.

> Such limited room in the hobbit pulley at the

> fully open position.

> I was thinking about the camino pulley the other

> day. Since the spring is mostly external, what

> about modding the base and cap to accept a

> standard horizontal minarelli spring? Cuz they

> come in so many flavors.

Yes let's talk about this. It worked on my urban pulley, I hacked the clutch off, that was easy. These hobbit contras open the other way,, IN instead of fixed and variating out. How the fucks that go?

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Hello guys.

I am on the same quest here as you guys. And i think you guys are looking for springs in the wrong places. Instead of looking for scooter springs why not look for a spring designer company that makes springs. Like this one in Denmark.

http://www.industrial-springs.com/

I have ordered 4 springs from here and you can read more about it on this forum tread.

http://www.camino-tuning.be/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=31608&start=150#p673469

These springs comes with compression strength spesification so you can compare numbers against different springs. This makes it easier to find the right one for different setups.

I am not saying that i found the solution, but i found stronger springs that fits in the EU version. I have not been able to test i yet because of the snow and cold weather outside.

Sorry for my bad English language.

Regards Morten

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Back from the dead bump. Just got a Camino pulley, any progress on spring experiments?

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

#CrazyWayneβ„’ rocks. #CrazyWayne /

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

do hobbit springs fit on derbi flat reeds?

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Are you guys gonna make me do the gy6/zuma/jog spring mod

to the camino pulleys?

C'mon folks. You can do it!

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

BOING!!!!

image.jpg

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Do it JBot! I'll buy one from you and/or help fund some inventory. I got too many projects and too much money tied up to be experimenting right now.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

^ same.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Fine....assholes.

Doing tomorrow. I should get paid for this shit.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

#CrazyWayneβ„’ rocks. #CrazyWayne /

Yes Jbot do the R&D prototype China's factry's are standing by and ready so thy can clone it and sell me one.

Better yet just send the prototype to me so i don't have to buy one from China.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Yeah, China wants to clone some chicken shit euro moped pulley.

You getting CRAY! CRAYWAYNE!

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

#CrazyWayneβ„’ rocks. #CrazyWayne /

Then just send the prototype to me Jbot

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

If it works I'm gonna use it.

The camino pulley is shit without a choice in spring tensions.

So I have this gy6 70cc 4t scoot I turned into a standup scoot.

I knew it didn't accelerate fast enough, but never knew why.

Accel often has to do with the rear contra. Too stiff and you get up to speed slow (at least on 4t) regardless of vari weights.

So I checked the spring. Holy cow! So strong!

So I kept trying weaker and weaker springs until I put in the weakest I had.

Finally was zippy. Of course had to lighten the rollers.

Having a tunable rear pulley is imperative to dial in the performance

on any bike, and 2t is even more picky due to a peaky band.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

#CrazyWayneβ„’ rocks. #CrazyWayne /

I like the rear contra springs with the toque tang on them and ramps on the back side.

It works like an auto lonch-lever.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

Gy6 /jog spring isn't gonna work.

Forgot it has to go into the stupid hub.

So we're gonna do some free physics.

If ya don't know, when you shorten a spring it make it stiffer (dumbed down version)

Now ya know.

Then utilizing a PVC spacer in the hubs base (1.5in PVC pipe fits perfect)

We can shorten the length thus strengthening the springs force,

And add a PVC spacer to take up extra room up to the point of coilbinding,

Which coincidentally is now less cuz we chopped the spring.

My camino coilbound spring was 20mm.

Approx space between hub inner base and cap fully opened 33mm.

So in theory before even cutting we could get at least a 12mm spacer in there.

Oooh!

Keep in mind, this pulley only moves a bit under 1/2 inch,

So we can really have some fun here. Stock camino spring is 3.25in uncompressed.

The camino spring is about 3.5mm wire. Most gy6/jog med springs are about 4mm. So my plan is to cut off a tad and then check coilbound height and shim accordingly.

Any bets?

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

I'll take a bet on killer low, hard rev drop and fall out of the pipe with the 12 spacer.

Side bet of cracked spacer after 5 runs. (edited)

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

New spring height: 67mm

Original spring: about 82mm

Coilbound height:14mm

So, using math and legend, I will make a spacer

That is 33-14=a number.

And I will take that number and make a spacer out of it.

POW.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

That's cuz you let fear rule you.

Re: Lets pool our contra spring knowledge!

How much? Cuz I want all your money.

C'mon! (edited)

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