Have been using 43mm Malossi kits for a little while and absolutely love them, but looking to join the big leauges on my super bravo build with aftermarket cases and a 46mm kit (or I guess some are 46.5mm). I see some options out there (Athena, Malossi, Pinasco, Polini). . . and not sure which to go with. I won't be doing side intake or full circle crank tho.
What's your favorite and why? (edited)
The Pinasco 46mm is amazing. fits on stock bored cases and has stock transfers you can match to a Speed case if that's your choice.
The Pinasco kit on my big wheel ciao is so torquey it popped two spokes outta my rear wheel when I left a stop light in a rush.
I also have the 46mm Athena, and Malossi DEPS (old). The Athena has a ton of potential as well, with Aux Exh ports, so you should be able to port it for more hi rpm power. The Pinasco is happiest peaked between 8.5-9.5 k, which is typically more than enough given it's punch.
The DEPS I have yet to use, but it is beautifull made, but is obviously best used with the RV cases.
I second the pinasco, some of the same reasons. Great on bored stock or speed cases. Porting potential, great finish/quality control, sort of a budget build potential.
There are a lot of great kits for Vespa mopeds, really depends on your budget and the amount of work you want to do to ,ake all the pieces work together.
Thanks guys didn't know the pinasco would fit on bored stock cases. I love this idea. I'm getting recs elsewhere on the pinasco and given its price compared to other kits, it would be nice to use some stock cases I have lying around.
I'm rethinking not having side case induction though. I was told having the carb that much closer to the actual crank is huge for power. Are there options to do side case induction on STOCK cases?
You can definitely get great power out of a side reed, not due to have the carb closer to the crank. It's mostly just due to the lack of limitation in carb sizing.
The treats side intake is about the cheapest you'll get. And I would still suggest running a full circle crank with that, which takes away some of that cheapness.
Declan's absolutely right, though. With Vespa, you either have to spend or build. The more you spend, the less finagling you'll have to do modifying components.
I have two set of bored stock cases, and while they are nice, the Malossi RV cases are perfect, and PERFECtly match the DEPS kit. It's nice to not have to worry about that stuff if you can afford it.
I will tell you, that even with the Pinasco and a good pipe, you'll always be limited by the 13.13, in terms of ultimate output. My pinasco setup is punchy as hell, but there's no way it's revving over 9k, ever. If you're looking to really get everything out of the cylinder, definitely future proof by having the option to increase your intake side flow.
I didn’t really notice much more power from the polini 46mm vs the malossi 43mm I think that’s due to the size of the transfer ports. With the increased skirt diameter it leaves less room for the transfer/boost ports. Here are my gasket templates from the polini with a malossi 43 and a dr 43 set on top to kinda see what I’m taking about.
The 43 malossi is on my grande and the 46 polini is on my chopper so it’s a bit heavier. I’m running a vm18 with the polini with the reed case half.
I just can't get down with 46 on stock cases, they are so small and flimsy as it is, taking a significant amount of material out of them just sounds like asking for trouble.
Speed cases are what, like 140? To never have to worry about it blueing out or leaking, that seems like a good investment in my book.
If you want to save money, the DR is way better than the malossi, easily 1k more rpm on the top end and very well balanced with the 13:13. I've never built 46mm Vespa before, the Dr's are plenty. They go together really nice and rip.
> Graham Motzing Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> I just can't get down with 46 on stock cases, they are so small and
> flimsy as it is, taking a significant amount of material out of them
> just sounds like asking for trouble.
Using the Malossi case cutter there's no fear of blowing anything out. 2/2 success rate so far.
> Speed cases are what, like 140? To never have to worry about it blueing
> out or leaking, that seems like a good investment in my book.
I would buy the speed cases, but I hate that they come pre-cut with the whacky polini transfers.
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> The treats side intake is about the cheapest you'll get. And I would
> still suggest running a full circle crank with that, which takes away
> some of that cheapness.
Run a full circle crank if you want, but you DON'T have to.
Any quality crank will work with the CNC side case intake.
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Using the Malossi case cutter there's no fear of blowing anything out.
> 2/2 success rate so far.
>
You offering to do some? I'm surprised nobody is offering the service. I have seen so many badly done cases that I don't even know what they should look like done right
> Graham Motzing Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
>
> > -------------------------------------------------------
>
> > Using the Malossi case cutter there's no fear of blowing anything out.
>
> > 2/2 success rate so far.
>
> >
>
> You offering to do some? I'm surprised nobody is offering the service.
> I have seen so many badly done cases that I don't even know what they
> should look like done right
Weirdly I never though about that...
Here's the quality of the cut you get.
> Jason ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks guys didn't know the pinasco would fit on bored stock cases. I
> love this idea. I'm getting recs elsewhere on the pinasco and given its
> price compared to other kits, it would be nice to use some stock cases I
> have lying around.
>
> I'm rethinking not having side case induction though. I was told having
> the carb that much closer to the actual crank is huge for power. Are
> there options to do side case induction on STOCK cases?
PM me if you want side induction. I have the treats cnc one with a matching 4 petal block and intake for sale. Could even through in a vm18
I wish I would have bought that tool when treats was selling, I would pay to have some cases bored nicely.
I bet they could maybe be able to find more if you ask.
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > Graham Motzing Wrote:
>
> > -------------------------------------------------------
>
> > I just can't get down with 46 on stock cases, they are so small and
>
> > flimsy as it is, taking a significant amount of material out of them
>
> > just sounds like asking for trouble.
>
> Using the Malossi case cutter there's no fear of blowing anything out.
> 2/2 success rate so far.
>
>
>
> > Speed cases are what, like 140? To never have to worry about it
> blueing
>
> > out or leaking, that seems like a good investment in my book.
>
> I would buy the speed cases, but I hate that they come pre-cut with the
> whacky polini transfers.
so the wacky transfers on the polini speed cases are meant to be used with polini 70cc kits then? I've been pondering this a lot after digesting the great info here and someone else hit it right on the head. Stock cases limit me to the 13mm intake and I'll just be fighting that. My grande is already as fast as I can likely get stock cases to go without MAJOR bottom end modification. And, the speed cases really aren't badly priced. $275 for the entire bottom end with the CDI, that's great.
But what 46mm top end to drop in there. . . hmm.
The speed cases are matched to the 46mm polini, but the work well with the 46mm Pinasco.
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