Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

Yeah without making a forming tool for this one time job i have no way to manually match the piston curve but i measured the piston with a t-bevel and it lined up pretty damn close for the 5mm of area its squishing.

Hopefully this will be much better than just slapping the head on with no modification. I still have about 1mm of material i can take off the deck of the cylinder while keeping the C/R under 10:1, but i will revisit that after the engine is broken in if need be.

Currently waiting on my replacement ring to show up so i can gap those and finally get the head studs torqued. Then itll be time to set up the CDI and hope she rips.

The engine was described as looking like an angry blender today so thats what my moped is now powered by.

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

Rings gapped out to .008, and .009 without any adjusting so hoping thats good enough, everything is all sealed up and tourqued, ready to go back onto the bike tomorrow.

Squish is a little bigger than i had hoped for at .080" (2mm) But i figured once its broken in then i can take the cylinder off and deck a mmm off if i feel its not performing how i want.

I still need to wire up the cdi and put the roller guide in the variator but hoping to burn some gas by tomorrow night.

Thanks for the help all, will update once its all tuned in,

Any suggestions for where i should start with jetting?

Dellorto 15.15 with stock mesh screens, Airsal 45mm 70cc kit, modded blunderbuss, and about 300 feet elevation.

(edited)

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

Got it all timed up at 1.2mm btdc and now it starts with 2 or 3 kicks from cold.

With the 68 jet the dellorto comes with, i topped out at 35 flat ground, jumped up to a 74 and lost another 3 mph. So im expecting to land around 72 or 70 when i have some time to play with jetting. The goal is 40 with ease, and i currently have 7g weights in the variator which is roughly equal to a 4 ball guide with 2 balls in it.

I also think a pipe will help it rev, though i want to get it jetted right before ordering a doppler. I also want to shave some material off the deck because the C/R is a little low, but that was on purpose because i didn't know how dramatic everyone was being when reporting overheating their heads.

Currently fighting the lighting setup, and getting the 12vAC rectified to DC. waiting on a generic 4 wire R/R from what looks like a gy6 that i will play around with.

Re: first av10 build

Did you derestrict the pipe? Is anything else causing drag? Is it variating all the way?

That setup should be going a solid 40+

You're definitely working your way into this the right way, I wouldn't say not to get a pipe but you might want to tune it a bit more and see if you're leaving something on the table.

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

Dropped it down to a 72 and got it back to 33, and i think it may have just a few more rpm to go for it to variate fully so i can try the 8 gram weights in it. I do still want to shave the deck because the C/R is still down around 8.5, would like to see it around 9-9.5.

Will try the weights combined with a 70 jet and see if it keeps trending upward, but 68 seems like a small jet for this setup in 40 degree weather does it not? I got it registered today so i can be a little less careful with my test rides.

The way i understand it is the expansion chamber has a big effect on max rpm so it makes sense if the stock one falls off at a certain range, I did de-restrict the blunderbuss.

I also have an inductive tach on the way to see if i can get any info from that.

Re: first av10 build

Don't listen to keyboard warriors on what your jet should be, most of these people have hella air leaks. Aside from a starting point I really hate to even say. You can always plug chop too, as a sanity check, shas are notorious for running 'pretty ok' even when they are way off, and they are super touchy about air filter.

This is kinda why is hard to just jump into performance stuff, there is a certain feeling... I've heard it called 'la patate' ... Maybe 'the potato', although that is pomme de terre au francais. A guy on here used to say 'harmonious' like the engine is singing in harmony. When you've got it everything is just happy jamming along, like bob ross style. when you are off you won't see your full potential, gotta figure out why.

On the internet I have no idea what your bikes doing, I just know top speed. 8.5 is good c.r. your head is awesome, you might be able to futz with the shimming to get port timing better but I'm guessing your not getting everything out of your tune. I've hacked together way sloppier builds than that and had them in the high 40s.

Re: first av10 build

Tweaker trash /

> Graham Motzing Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Don't listen to keyboard warriors on what your jet should be, most of

> these people have hella air leaks. Aside from a starting point I really

> hate to even say. You can always plug chop too, as a sanity check, shas

> are notorious for running 'pretty ok' even when they are way off, and

> they are super touchy about air filter.

>

> This is kinda why is hard to just jump into performance stuff, there is

> a certain feeling... I've heard it called 'la patate' ... Maybe 'the

> potato', although that is pomme de terre au francais. A guy on here

> used to say 'harmonious' like the engine is singing in harmony. When

> you've got it everything is just happy jamming along, like bob ross

> style. when you are off you won't see your full potential, gotta figure

> out why.

>

> On the internet I have no idea what your bikes doing, I just know top

> speed. 8.5 is good c.r. your head is awesome, you might be able to futz

> with the shimming to get port timing better but I'm guessing your not

> getting everything out of your tune. I've hacked together way sloppier

> builds than that and had them in the high 40s.

It’s a $100 kit just run the bitch! It’s like pointless on so many levels to spends hours and more money. It’s junk new treat like it! I buy new kits with the rings to fat all the time.

If you sold bbs would u rather:

count a 1000 bb individually or find the weight of the ≈1000 add a few grams?

Time is money

Re: first av10 build

Graham is 100% right. Every bike is a little different. I have had similar builds that have had completely different jetting.

Always love the “la grosse patate” The Big Potato! Hahaha

With the SHA and French bikes they can be touchy. Are your running the screens and the plastic cover? There is a lot of air restriction there. A good friend of mine, who has way more patience with French tuning then I do, will get the jetting close then remove and add screens until he gets it just right. I am lazy and just usually pop out all the screens except 2 or 3. This way it is still blocking some of the dust and dirt. I have even just said forget the screens and ran just the black cap. I don’t really recommend that because it is just deflecting stuff at this point, but sometimes I don’t care.

But back to what Graham said, don’t listen to naysayers if your temps are fine and plug chop looks good. All bikes are different to some extent. Some people have air leaks and don’t know it or they are running a old SHA with a terrible shim that is letting in a small amount of air all the time....and maybe emcee an ovalized intake from taking the carb off all the time. Keep messing with it. You will get it right. French bikes are finicky, one small adjustment may make all the difference.

Oh and you really did a nice job putting this motor together 👌🏻

Re: first av10 build

> Tweaker trash Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

>

>

> It’s a $100 kit just run the bitch! It’s like pointless on so many

> levels to spends hours and more money. It’s junk new treat like it!

You're a garbage person rocco, it takes so much self control not to delete your dumbass 'advice'

I blast losers like you at every rally and have never once loaded up in a breakdown van. What's the point in just sucking at things over and over again and never learning or growing as a person?

Tuning is the art of mopeds, blasting a country road with the engine singing in harmony and every bearing, spring and little part moving in a perfect chorus is like staring at a Degas masterpiece and seeing every perfect detail. The way it makes your brain feel and the satisfaction of knowing you turned a bunch of cut rate garbage parts into a masterpiece is worth every minute. Some hater was probably giving davinci shit for the 4th time he painted over the mona lisa but that loser is lost to time and millions of people have felt the power and joy from a tiny little painting of a kinda ugly chick done to obsessive perfection.

It's awesome to see someone new to the hobby who gets it, that's why my advice is to really bear down and get it perfect. Adding a pipe makes the tuning a lot harder, it throws everything off and makes it harder to feel where that sweet spot is. This setup is so good with the stock pipe when it's really dialed, it's one of my 'go to' builds for a reason.

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

Thanks for the kind words, I get that things can be cheap for a reason, but isn't that the allure? Take something centered around economical transport and squeeze every bit of performance out of it?

I haven't had a chance to try anything yet because I'm also renovating some rooms in the house, but if my experience with motorcycles has taught me anything, I'll have to re jet this all in the summer anyways, because 35f is a lot different than 80f.

As far as the air filter goes, I think I'd prefer using a foam pod over the screens, and I'd be willing to go to a carb with more than one circuit, though I doubt this engine needs that much tuneability.

I did leave the grease in the crank bearings that they come packed with from the factory, so that could be introducing some drag until it finds its way out of them from the oil air mix thinning it.

Re: first av10 build

Well....you get it. To me that is what it is all about.

The screens and stuff really are a pain. A air box is really the way to go. However I always have a hard time finding a location I like, just because they are big. Jbot has a good write up on his Shampoo Bottle air box.

JBot air box

If your use to tuning motorcycles, the single circuit carb is a drag. I have had good success modifying the SHA Slide from Graham’s blog and in the WIKKI. On a stock setup it is not usually necessary, but it does allow you to get a better tune overall. The problem I always had is with larger pipes and SHAs is that you could tune it for low or high but never get it right for both. Modifying the slide allows you to have both.

If your picky about tuning I always recommend the PHBG over the Minkuni. For smaller displacement I always like the PHBG17. It is harder to find and I usually have to go to eBay. It usually has the AN atomizer and you have to change it to the AU. But to me it is worth it. My biggest issue with the minkuni is their needles are not in any specific oder. Trying to find a slightly different taper is a nightmare because unlike PHBGs. The needle charts are all over the place.

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

Been a little while since ive updated anything here,

Got the LED head and tail light working today with a 4 wire regulator/rectifier. slapped some more comfy bars on it and took her for a beer run. Topping out at 37 flat ground now that the weather is above freezing (high of 50f today)

will probably end up putting the 68 jet back in once spring breaks through as it 4 strokes just a teensy bit before it gets to operating temp.

Other than that i just need to find a seat that doesnt have a snapped and rotted pan, maybe some canvas saddle bags, and a head tube brace. Ripping good enough for now, but since i know myself ill probably order a doppler pipe next week because i cant leave well enough alone.

BMXmoped.jpg

Any suggestions on other stuff to add/change? things a blast

Re: first av10 build

Tweaker trash /

Yea but for right now it’s chill

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

So while i wait for my seat to show up along with what i think will be a better air filter, Ive been considering pipe options if i cant get a few more mph out of the blunderbuss. I dont mind having to change some angles to fit an AV10 pipe to the AV7, and right now im kind of stuck between the treats curvy PMA pipe, or a simonini circuit. I cant seem to find any real feedback about either one in regards to mobys or pugs other than the one thread that talks about cutting open the sim circuit to cut out the baffles.

Looking at pipes to let the motor spin just a little bit faster, i have a sneaking suspicion that the stocker just isnt breathing enough at the higher rpms.

Input on either of these pipes?

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

got some more tuning time in, put on an air filter that wasnt just some expanded steel like the dellorto ones were, and installed the cnc zone intake from treats.

popped the 68 jet in and it will now do 40 on the flats, which is just fine with me. If i go any faster i think i need to do some bracing on the swingarm, and slap an ebr fork with a cross bar to feel less sketched out.

I might add a circuit pipe to fatten up the middle of the power, but im not 100% sure on that. for now it does exactly what i wanted to.

Need to figure out why the brakes still suck, and maybe add some blinkers because hand signals are sketchy when you need fistfuls of brake to make that stop sign.

if i wanna get really picky ill blend the intake on the cylinder to match the intake runner.

Re: first av10 build

> Justin Caswell Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> hand signals are sketchy when you need fistfuls of

> brake to make that stop sign.

Slow down sooner .

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

bah, thats no fun

Re: first av10 build

> Justin Caswell Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> bah, thats no fun

Small price for the rest of the fun . ;)

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

So i tried downjetting again to 66, and i think thats just the right amount of rich. flat ground will cruise 41 with no headwind.

Ordered a simonini circuit pipe because i like spending money i guess.

in a few weeks ill probably add a crossbar because im a big boi and dont really get the warm fuzzys with a 40 year old stamped frame.

new paint eventually

profit???

Re: first av10 build

Justin Caswell /
boop OP

got around to fitting the simonini pipe, it was made for an av10 so i had to do some adjustments.

one cut on the header to bend it for the av7

and one cut for the stinger to clear the stand at full variation, as well as a new hole and trimming the mounting tab

want to play around with jetting more, but just adding the pipe alone got me to 43 flat ground, and i took some weight out of the variator so it gets up and goes much better now.

I have an aluminum pug pulley to put on in an effort to lighten up the spinning bits, as well as not have a pulley thats all bent to shit.

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