Re: Pinto RR

Papa putting me in my place! Ha!

Yeah I would be willing to bet it was running without a head gasket that did you in. Some folks run with out them but they end up using a copper spray to make it seal.

I do not use studs on my exhaust or intake. I remove them if I can or do not install them on new kits. I use standard m6 bolts, the black hardened ones are the best. Just be 100% certain you get the bolt in straight and you will be golden.

Re: Pinto RR

Running no head gasket is fine if you polish the mating surfaces.

I am almost certain I learned that on MA. Mrrbrr even from the wiki?

Use a piece of plate glass and progressively finer sand paper. Figure 8s, 1/4 turn, more figure 8’s. It’s like prepping fiber optic cable (if that’s something you can relate to?)

It will raise compression some losing the gasket and removing a tiny bit of material when polishing. One less thing to worry about.

Torque is an elusive quantity. I mean, there is a proper number, but it’s not like you’re gonna set it and forget it. Each heat cycle, and all them good vibrations, is gonna work new shit loose.

After new gaskets and stuff, I get stuff what I feel is snug enough to not leak (real great answer; I know) ride around a bit and let it cool down. Things will be loose. Snug it back down. Repeat until you put a wrench on a cool fastener and it don’t want to be any more snug. Aluminum is easy to rip threads out of. Err on the side of caution.

You shouldn’t need thread lock or sealing goo on anything. Especially when you’re tuning because stuff is coming apart and going back on all the time. Those things can be great when you’re “done” so that things will stay put longer. I just make a habit of going over everything with a 10mm socket wrench after almost every ride. Trust, but verify.

A dab of anti-seize on the spark plug is extra security. Fresh spark plug gets 1/2 turn after the crush gasket engages the head. After the initial crush, next time you only give it 1/12 - 1/8 turn.

Just don’t over tighten anything. Nothing on a moped needs ham fisted torque. If it is leaking, it needs new gaskets or seals.

Re: Pinto RR

> Papa _ Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

>

> Just don’t over tighten anything. Nothing on a moped needs ham fisted

> d torque. If it is leaking, it needs new gaskets or seals.

I am right handed so I tighten things down with my left "weaker" hand. It helps me not overtighten things. I also grab close to the head of the ratchet when tightening down so I cant get great leverage either.

Yes there is a specific torque listed for every nut and bolt on the engine. You can find them listed in the various parts manuals in the wiki.

Papa has got some words of wisdom for sure.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Great pieces of advice guys thank you. New Parts are one they way to rebuild top end and tune the clutch, on the mean wile I'll keep derusting parts. I hope to share some progress soon.

Best.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Hi, guys, here are the pictures of the clutch. Lucky me I have a two shoes.

It has some rust but it looks good what do ya think?

I'm guessing that using evaporust won't be a good idea for the pads right.

Any extra advice to install the new springs? I got the black ones.

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20210125_184213.jpg

Re: Pinto RR

That looks like the kind of surface rust that would clean right off with a little steel wool and rubbing.

The clutch is normally soaked in oil. Did the transmission side sit dry for an extended period?

As far as the spring goes, what type of performance you looking for? Do you want a clutch to last for miles and miles of riding? Or do you want to drag race?

Re: Pinto RR

For clutch spring tuning, I assume you bought the springs already. I suggest the black eso ones if not.

Get a fishing scale so you can test the tension strength of the installed springs to get them even.

They are simple though. Just unscrew the tension screw and let the old springs fall out. Put in the new springs and tighten the tension screw back down.

I did not have a scale when I did mine so I made some Mark's on the clutch arms and screws and counted the turns to remove the screw that way I could turn the screws back to an even tension. I ended up leaving the screws flush bit am planning on getting back in to tighten them up a little more for my kit, but it would be pretty good for a stock setup.

Just take a wire brush to get the rust off. You can deglaze your clutch pads if they need it.

It's pretty simple and can make a big difference in acceleration. Just can be a pain in the butt to remove your tranny each time you want to make another adjustment. Get a few tranny cover gaskets to have in case you rip yours while tuning things.

Dont over tighten the tension screws. They can drop out of the arm and are almost impossible to get re-threaded and out once that happens.

Maybe someone can chime in with an optimal tension weight for the springs. What their reading on their scale was.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Papa, I'm willing to trade longevity by take off anytime. And transmission was wet until Sunday.

I can use steel wool. Now should I soak the clutch in oil before putting it back again?

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Yes Jay I got the eso black. Not sure how to deglaze but I can google it. But it will be more to deglaze my brakes pads. I think the next upgrade is to make this thing to brake better. Is not all about speed... LOL

Re: Pinto RR

Just take some sand paper to the pads. Nothing too rough but something that will take the surface off that is shiny from friction heat causing the fibers to melt together in a smooth glassy surface. They should be hard but have almost a softness to the touch. Dont go too crazy on sanding you just want to remove the glaze not a bunch of the pad.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Hi Guys. Long story short, ended up adding the 6 ports 48cc cylinder and piston from Treats. Change to black springs flush with Synt 10w30.

First run with #72 main 2,17 and 3rd noch from top was lame. It bog down at 1/2 throttle and take of was worst that before.

Not sure why I did some. Stupid reverse thinking. But I changed to #70 and 2nd notch and it's was the worst response ever had hesitations and Four-stroking.

Check and found a little airleak on the intake/cilinder. Temp around 250F.

I'm guessing it is fuel starvation.?

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Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

By the way, My timing setup is stock at 17° BTDC, not sure if I need to change it to help with the extra ports. I also I discovered the Spark Plug Boot was not fitted right so that will be sure my hesitation problem in my second test run.

Re: Pinto RR

Roffman will be best to comment on your bing setup, but definitely address all other air leaks before tuning the carb. My bikes dont leave the stand until they are free of air leaks. Easy way to seize up your new kit. Also make sure you do a few heat cycles before you try giving it too much speed.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Jay I soaked Gasket in oil this time... So I'm not sure what else to do in order to get rid of the freaking air leak. Double gasket maybe?

Re: Pinto RR

You can get a thicker single gasket. The super thin ones that come with the kits might be too thin for your bike. Careful to not get too thick as it can adjust your port timing a bit.

Try running two in order to see what thickness you need.

I just ordered a thicker base gasket for my tomos to intentionally raise the exhaust timing a little.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Jay, big update, Pretty much restored everything and finish the pinto the way I wanted in raw metal (picture attached).

But it's still runs poorly... I'm very frustrated though. The thing bogs down on take off and it is super slow so I have to work with the throttle so much until something in between 1/2-2/3 throttle where it seems to rev fine and the pipe hit like a mule. Some times also does some hesitations around 1/2 throttle.

I checked and there are no leaks at all.

15 bing 82 - main jet

2.17 - atomizer and 2nd top notch.

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Re: Pinto RR

Fun times! Mid throttle is going to be your needle setting. Might try making it a little richer by moving the clip downa notch. How have your plug chops been coming out? Do a run just at 1/2 throttle and see what the chop looks like.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Totally Agree Jay I have plans to do a plug chop this weekend. I would try maybe with a smaller main jet and the 1st notch.

Re: Pinto RR

Dirty30 Dillon /

What kit are you running? My guess is your main is too big and your needle settings aren't dialed in.

Also, if you have an airleak none of this troubleshooting will matter until you sort it out. 90% of airleaks I see on bikes built by customers at the shop are caused by either bad surface prep or mis-installation.

Did you rebuild the bottom end? Are you using a stock intake?

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Hi Dirty30, Thank you for you thoughts.

The kit is the50cc tccd, It took me a lot of work but the system seems to be airtight , no leaks at all. The filter is the metal hi flow you mighty see it in the pictures. The bottom end remain stock. I totally agree with you with the Main jet an the needle.

Should I try maybe 68-70 for main and first notch.? What should be a typical idle adjustment? can this affect also the setup?

Re: Pinto RR

Start with the clip in the middle after any jetting changes. Then move it as needed.

Re: Pinto RR

Carlos Campi /

Update. Moped is running very good, thanks to all you guys and your valuable pieces of information.

Did a good test run on Saturday. 38 Mph top speed on flats (GPS)

Max temp 290°

Main jet 70 and second notch from bottom.

Take off is still slow and still Bogs downs a little but it got way better. I'll keep playing with the needle, perhaps make it richer.

WOT it's good I'm guessing it is a little lean since it does not four stroke at all when I cut the throttle down. But temp seems to be good, I'll do a chop read to be on the safe side and adjust.

In any case this thing is good to go, I need the space for my next project.

Re: Pinto RR

If your max temp is only 290, you could downjet just a tad and see if you pick up speed. I’d stay around 330-350 wot, but also If you’re happy with that speed those temps are great. You’ll never half to worry about watching the temp gauge

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